Sent: 3/15/2011 8:21:57 A.M. Central Daylight Time
Subj: Fw: WISCONSIN TEACHER ACTUAL WAGES - THIS WILL GET YOUR ATTENTION
Subj: Fw: WISCONSIN TEACHER ACTUAL WAGES - THIS WILL GET YOUR ATTENTION
WISCONSIN TEACHER ACTUAL WAGES - THIS WILL GET YOUR ATTENTIONOH TO BE A TEACHER OR COLLEGE PROFESSOR IN WISCONSINSubject: 2010 Wisconsin Teacher Actual Wages - THIS WILL GET YOUR ATTENTION!No wonder the unions don't want to give up their power. . . .ATTACHED: This is the official excel DPI database of Wisconsin teachers' wages by school district. Look up your own district !!!
AVERAGE WAGE AND BENEFITS (remember this is for about 9 months of work) includes a computation for retirement benefits, health and life insurance, sick day pay accrual, vacation days, personal holidays.
TEACHERS:Milwaukee $86,297Elmbrook $91,065Germantown $83,818Hartland Arrwhd $90,285 (highest teacher was $122,952-lowest was $64,942)Men Falls $81,099West Bend $82,153Waukesha $92,902Sussex $82,956Mequon $95,297Kettle Mor $87,676Muskego $91,341STAFF:Arrowhead - Bus Mng - Kopecky - $169,525Arrowhead - Principal - Wieczorek - $152,519Grmtwn - Asst Princ - Dave Towers - $123,222Elmbrk - Burliegh Elemetary - Principal Zahn- $142,315 (for a primary school!!)Madison - Asst Principal - McGrath - $127,835UNIVERSITY of WISCONSIN STAFF (2009) (salary alone):Michael Knetter - Prof of Bus - $327,828Carolyn Martin - Chancellor Mad- $437,000Hector Deluca - Prof of Nutritional Science - $254,877 (really??)(source: Madison.com -as the UW removed salaries from being posted online in 2007- why if they are so low?)How about some other "public servant job" ??? What do they make?Madison Garbage men (2009) (salary only):· Garbageman, Mr. Nelson earned $159,258 in 2009, including $109,892 in overtime and other pay.· Garbageman, Greg Tatman, who earned $125,598· 7 Madison garbage men made over $100,000· 30 Madison garbage men made over $70,000MILWAUKEE CITY BUS DRIVERS (salary only):136 Drivers made more than $70,00054 Drivers made more than $80,00018 Drivers made more than $90,0008 Drivers made more than $100,000Top Driver made $117,000(Source WTMJ)
(The average private bus driver makes $9-13 an hour (about 20,000 year) with no pension, or healthcare.)AND WE ARE SUPPOSED TO CONTINUE PAYING 100% OF THEIR GENEROUS RETIREMENT? THEY HAVE SHUT DOWN SCHOOLS AS THEY DON'T WANT TO PAY 5.8% OF IT THEMSELVES ....REALLY?
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20 comments:
Those damn evil teachers doing a job that most people don't want to do. It is sooooo easy all you do is go in sit down watch the kids for a little while. Take nice long extended lounge breaks during the day. Then you get three months off.
AND WE ARE SUPPOSED TO CONTINUE PAYING 100% OF THEIR GENEROUS RETIREMENT? THEY HAVE SHUT DOWN SCHOOLS AS THEY DON'T WANT TO PAY 5.8% OF IT THEMSELVES ....REALLY?
Nope. False. Wrong.
As has been said a million times, the workers in Wisconsin had ALREADY agreed to salary and benefit cuts in order to help balance the budget. None of the protests were about that. They were about the unjust and uncalled for stripping of collective bargaining rights.
Study after study has shown that public employees are NOT overpaid in comparison to private employees.
The average private bus driver makes $9-13 an hour (about 20,000 year) with no pension, or healthcare
And this is a good thing? People who operate the difficult and potentially dangerous buses which get millions of people to and from work or other destinations should be treated as low skill lackeys? Their work doesn't have value?
Recently in New York there was a horrific private charter bus crash which killed 15 and injured every passenger on board. Was the driver drunk? Cut off? A maniac? No. Indications are that the driver fell asleep at the wheel, possibly as a result of working a double shift out of economic necessity.
As for University Professors, UW Madison is a top notch research university which provides an outstanding educational opportunity to the young people of Wisconsin. The few salaries quoted here are not out of line for such a university, and I guarantee that most professors don't make amounts out of line with the market. Indeed, its typical for professors to make less at a public university like UW Madison then they could at a private university.
No wonder the unions don't want to give up their power. . . .
As well they shouldn't. The bigger question is this: why are you so eager to give up yours?
This is classic class warfare: turn one half of the working stiffs against the other half. Convince them that its ok that they live in mud, so long as their neighbors live in shit. All the while distracting them from the fact that the true villains are stealing off into the night with every last dime.
If those salaries are too high, what would conservatives recommend we pay a private-sector employee with a Bachelor's or Master's degree and twenty years of experience in their field? I'm guessing not $350,000 a year.
"The average private bus driver makes $9-13 an hour (about 20,000 year) with no pension, or healthcare."
Yeah, someone desperate enough to work for that amount of money is EXACTLY who I want to put in charge of driving a vehicle full of children. When jobs pay poorly, people have little incentive to keep the job, or do a good job. And the temptation to supplement their income is strong - either legally, by working multiple jobs and driving sleep-deprived, or by less-than-legal means.
Yes, let's have our kids driven around by the desperate! What could possibly go wrong?
Quiz time!
Hey conservatives, who made these statements:
“We must close union offices, confiscate their money and put their leaders in prison. We must reduce workers salaries and take away their right to strike”
“Where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost.”
Give up?
The first one was Adolf Hitler, May 2, 1933.
The second one was Ronald Reagan, September 1, 1980.
Interesting, no?
(Hat tip to Mark at Newscorpse)
"OH TO BE A TEACHER OR COLLEGE PROFESSOR IN WISCONSIN "
Sure, why not? Just pay to go to the college of your choice to get a BA/BS, then pay to do a 5th year of teaching credentials, and more than likely *also* pay for a Masters Degree. And in the case of Univ Professors, pay to do a PhD. Not to mention: working hard to get decent grades, spending time student teaching & interning to learn the ropes, etc.
You, too, can be a teacher or Univ Professor... that is: if you have the "smarts" and the grit & determination to do the degrees to get there.
Why do conservatives feel that highly educated citizens who "work so hard" shouldn't get paid a fair wage? I know quite a few teachers and Univ professors, and I can guarantee that, not only are they very smart & dedicated, they work really really hard. In the case of Univ Prof, for instance, most/all have to do stints as Head of their Dept, which requires an extra amount of uncompensated time doing a lot of Admin work.
All the teachers and Professors I know spend a LOT of time out of the classroom doing other kinds of work, such as grading homework, meeting with students to give them extra tutoring, meeting with parents, etc.
Great way to be a KNOW-NOTHING while being very misled by David Koch, who had his minion write this nasty diatribe to pit you against other working stiffs, who do their jobs well and deserve what they make.
Why is making around $142K per year as a Primary School Principal looked on as outrageous? I note that while there's this "outrage" over that salary, there's no indication of how large the Primary School is, how many students, how many teachers, etc.
Geez, try running a school for a day and see how friggin "easy" it is.
Why is it so outrageous for a Univ Prof of Bus Admin to make $327K?? After all, that person has a PhD and most likely comes to the Univ with a certain amount of private industry work experience. That Prof could probably go back into the private sector and make double or triple that salary, as no doubt the students who graduate from the Bus program often do.
All these conservatives justify insanely high salaries and benefits for private sector CEOs (to the tune of millions and millions) - buying into the Elite's hype that to "attract" good CEOS, they have to be paid ginormous salaries (which is bull) - yet the professor of such budding CEOs should be paid what? Some paltry amount??
Makes no sense. Get a clue, conservatives! All you have to lose are the chains that bind you and the blinders that blind you.
I have no idea if those figures are real, but my wife, who teaches elementary school in another state, earns nowhere near that.
She has a master's degree and 30 years of experience and now earns a whopping $60,000 per year. Unlike many private sector employees, she does not get a single day of paid vacation, though she does get two months off without pay each year.
Oh, and she hasn't had a raise in ten years as she's at the top of the pay scale.
A couple of weeks ago, a student in the adjacent classroom defecated in his pants and proceeded to throw feces around the classroom.
Yeah, pay cuts are in order across the board.
The figures offered are for salary + benefits, and I'm guessing that the income has been *padded* to include extra for vacation & sick leave, which really isn't collected. In other words, I question the accuracy of these income figures.
Like Charlie (and others above), I know a number of teachers who've been working for at least 20 years or more. All are at the top end of their salaries; all have a Masters Degree or equivalent. And none are making more than $65k per year.
I do know one High School Principal who makes around $107k per year, and that's after working in the school system for over 30 years and having 2 Masters Degrees.
School Superintendents tend to make in the $200s.
Again: I really question the veracity of these figures. They just don't jive with the reality that I know factually.
And anyway, why would you want your childrens' teachers to be paid such low wages that they might be forced to work 2d jobs to support themselves & their families? Don't you want your kids' teachers to be at their best and do a good job?
Guess not... seems like all these foolish people want is a babysitter or perhaps not even that.
Let’s take a look at Mr Nelson the Madison Garbage truck driver. Made $159,258 Of which $109,892 was overtime this means his regular wage for a 40 hr week was $49,366 per year. This figures out to $23.73 per hour. Time and a half at this wage comes to $35.60 per hour $109,892 over time divided by $35.60 comes to 3086 hrs of over time divided by 52 weeks comes to dam near 60 hrs per week over time to be exact 59.3 hrs. Mr Nelson is working 100 hrs a week 40 straight time and 60 time and half since I haven’t seen many garbage trucks running on Sundays I would suppose he does this six days a week this means he’s working 18 hrs per day Monday thru Friday and 10 hrs on sat. 52 weeks a year. I doubt if this is true but if it is then someone a lot higher up than Mr Nelson isn’t managing things very well looks like they could use some more drivers at $23.73 per hour. Since you think this is a better than normal amount and times being as hard as they are filling a few spots shouldn’t be hard. Granted if you hire another driver you would be out benefits for him insurance and other cost but I think for the $109,892 savings in over time would probably pay for it.
@ Anon
What you say is true, but all of that is also assuming that 1) the salary number quoted is correct and 2) This "Mr. Nelson" isn't some kind of supervisor managing all the garbage men, which would make a lot more sense.
I haven't been able to find the source of the quoted figure, so for all we know this was pulled from thin air. However, a quick search on Glassdoor.com shows that the average salary for a garbageman in Madison, WI is 22,000 a year.
I question these figures. Where's the link to prove that they're accurate? Since there's no link, my conclusion is that they're falisfied in some way. As others have commented, there's just these rank financial numbers with no other info to go along with them.
We can argue until the cows come home whether these alleged salaries are fair or not, but what's the point without more factual data to back them up?
Show us the real facts, and then we can debate. Until then, I call b.s. Sent out to reliably gin up the base, who won't bother to question what David Koch tells them. Very foolish. Always check your sources.
$90,000 a year for 9 months = $10,000 a month.
10,000/20 working days in a month = $500 a day.
500/ 6 working hours a day = $83.33 an hour.
83.33/30 students in a day = $2.77
That is $2.77 per child per hour! You can't get a high schooler to babysit at that rate. And who knows? Your kid might even get educated at the same time.
And, note that that counts $90,000 the same as cash (not all these benefit "equivalents" bullshit), working 6 hours a day (ha!) with 30 kids (uh huh).
I don't have time to do a proper search, but here's a news site with a searchable Wisconsin teacher salary database. I picked a random county (Sheboygan) and a random name on the list (#4 filtered by teacher) and got a full-time teacher with a Master's degree making $50,892.
Average salaries: "Secondary school teachers in the 90th wage percentile earned $69,550, while the entry-level teacher salary is generally in the $30,000s."
This site puts average salaries at 20th in the nation but 49th for starting teachers.
Wow! That is some pretty good cha-ching for doing an incredibly tough job but be careful what you criticize because these people are pretty close to being considered "elitist", whom you believe are the scourge of the earth. It doesn't matter where you live or what you earn in America, we are in the top 3% affluent people of the world. Instead of worrying what other people earn, try to better yourself and earn what you feel you are worth. Bunch of crybabies.
This email tries very hard to convince us of something that we know is not true. Anyone who knows a few teachers knows that teachers don't live in big, new houses and don't drive Hummers! They take lower pay than their private-sector neighbors and the trade-off is job security and benefits. They take a job with a definite salary cap and trade it for retirment benefits. Teachers aren't stealing jobs from other Americans and investing in other countries, they aren't making their living off selling worthless financial derivatives to the unsuspecting. They do an honorable job and give us a good return on our tax investment. They are an integral part of our middle class.
I'm a teacher's daughter, so I LMAO every time someone says that teaching is "nine months of work."
Motivating jealousy amongst private sector workers, who are getting paid less for doing more these days. Nice job deflecting attention from the fact that private sector workers should questioning their bosses' movtivations & employment practices, as well as their bosses' salaries.
Why would you want your fellow workers to *make less money* just because you think you're being stiffed by your private sector job?
Why is it that conservatives are so easily led into attacking others in the middle and working classes - based on dubious statistics - all while remaining complacent about the wealthy?
@ anon
"Why is it that conservatives are so easily led into attacking others in the middle and working classes - based on dubious statistics - all while remaining complacent about the wealthy?"
I'd chalk it up to their pronounced authoritarian streak.
They don't really think; they just follow their marching orders. A good place to look at this phenomenon in depth is 'The Authoritarian Specter' by Robert Altmeyer.
I strongly suspect that the incomes listed are inflated by including overtime ( where applicable ) and the and fuzzy math factoring in benefits in an equally rounded-to-the-next inflated fashion. They did the same thing with the auto workers during the bailout hoo-hah.
What I'd like to know is, where's the consistency though? When these same boot lickers attempt to whitewash executive compensation, they studiously exclude benefits/perks/stock options so as to trot out a more "reasonable" sounding base salary.
Like others have said here so far, I just can't understand the thought process of private sector working class member's outrage of public sector working classes income, all while ignoring the plutocratic elephant in the room.
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